Nearly a year on from Manchester United’s humiliation at Barcelona’s hands in the Champions League final and it is now clear that the Reds have not closed the gap on the Catalan side – a statement of the obvious. Yet, ‘closing the gap’ was a familiar refrain in the weeks after the 3-1 Wembley defeat, with the debate among fans and manager centring on how United could recover ground the lost to Pep Guardiola’s outstanding side. But in the 293 days since United capitulated to Barça in such dispiriting fashion the Reds not only failed to catch the four times European Champions, but have gone significantly backwards.
In total United lost four times in European competition this season; knocked out of two separate tournaments on route. But that tells only part of the story in a campaign that saw United perform middling at best on 10 occasions in succession. Indeed, even rare wins in Europe over the past seven months have come with caveats; neither of United’s victories over Romanian debutants Oţelul Galaţi came with any great flair, while the defeat of Ajax in Amsterdam was earned on barely 30 minutes of quality football.
More common, Sir Alex Ferguson’s side has plumbed depths of performance in Europe that, thankfully, have not been matched in more than five years. While Old Trafford draws with Benfica and FC Basel were infirm, worse was to come away in Switzerland. Yet, none of those results was a patch on the humiliating thumping handed down by Athletic Bilbao in the past week – a side, albeit talented, that currently lies seventh in La Liga.
It was not, of course, the loss to Bilbao that hurt most this season. Many United fans, mindful of the Premier League challenge from Manchester City ahead, felt a sense of relief that the Reds must no longer go through the Thursday-Sunday Europa routine. It comes to something when United has sunk to that depth - 125 years of proud history discarded in thumping defeat to one of Europe’s second ranked clubs.
More important though, the manner of defeat to the Basques was not only comprehensive, but wilfully lax on United’s part. Both at Old Trafford and Thursday night, in the atmospheric San Mames, there were times when United’s players simply did not care enough. Patrice Evra jogged through the match; Rooney put in the effort only when it suited him; Tom Cleverley strolled around as if taking part in an informal beach knockabout on holiday. The threesome was absolutely not alone in this sin.
In this observation there is no clichéd call for passion. It is a recognition that, at United, there is more than a century of institutional memory. It is more valuable than Thursday’s performance deserved.
“It’s been a disaster in the Champions League and in the Europa League now I think we have to tell the truth – we deserved to go out because we never played with the same desire as when we play in the league,” admitted Evra on Friday, one of the few in the United camp to recognise the catastrophe at hand.
“We can see the difference in the league. We are top of the league and we are more focused, I don’t know why. If we want to save the season we have to win the league. If we don’t win the league, it will be a really bad season.”
There are excuses for failure, of course. Injuries have played a part, but only a part, in United’s capitulation this season. During the Champions League group stages Ferguson’s side suffered for repeated and frequent absences as a full-blown injury crisis kicked in during the late autumn.
Yet, injuries were not the reason that United failed to make it out of the Champions League for the first time since 2005. Complacency from both players and manager on a truly massive scale was the true cause, and both were shameful; it is simply not the United way.
No wonder, then, that Ferguson spent most of Friday praising United’s spirit in the Premier League, drawing focus away from the matter at hand to a title run-in with rivals Manchester City that will consume supporters attention in the coming weeks.
The question now is whether United will learn lessons from a disastrous campaign. Just as Ferguson promised an answer to Barcelona’s superiority last May – and failed – so the club must now learn how to come back from a bottom-feeding campaign; to again compete at the very highest level. After all, the regression has put the lie to Ferguson’s recent claim that United is “not that far away” from Barcelona or Real Madrid’s level.
“There are always lessons to learn from every football match, whether you win or lose,” Sir Alex told Channel 5 immediately after defeat in Spain.
“It’s disappointing more than anything. We haven’t progressed in the Champions League and now we’re out of the Europa League. I think the best team went through. I don’t think we can complain about the result. I think that in the second half in particular Bilbao were the better team.
“What we have seen tonight and last Thursday is a team whose work rate is higher than anyone I have seen in Europe, and that takes you a long way. Apart from the fantastic work rate, they have some good qualities also. It’s not just their work rate getting them where they are at the moment – they’re showing some very good combination football and I think they can go the whole way.”
Indeed, Athletic’s was a brand of attacking, vibrant, and above all, committed football that United supporters can only dream of. In praise of Bilbao Ferguson was generous, but well he might be for it is certainly easier to praise an Athletic side that was better over the tie than any side United has faced, Barcelona aside, in the past two seasons, than address United’s long-running and obvious deficiencies.
One wonders whether spring 2013 will bring a similar debate – will Ferguson and his paymasters recognise decline before it sets in permanently, or offer another river of broken promises.
Ten months on and few lessons were learned
(53 posts) (11 voices)-
Posted 1 year ago #
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Alfonso Bedoya
Moderator
It's hard to understand Ferguson these days... who knows what the fuck he's thinking anymore?
When he said Barcelona taught us a lesson, and he would see that United would rise to the challenge... I was sure he knew exactly what was wrong, and was sure he had a real and definite plan to fix the problem... so how did we get so lost, and end up so far away from where we were supposed to be?
Was Ferguson seeing a totally different problem than nearly everyone else, and therefore had a totally different solution in mind?... if so, can someone explain to me what his solution is, cause I don't see it.
Or... did he see things the same way as everyone else, but just could find the solution?... and if this is the case, then I'd like to know why not.
"Badges, to god-damned hell with badges! We have no badges. In fact, we don't need badges. I don't have to show you any stinking badges, you god-damned cabrón and ching' tu madre! Come out from that shit-hole of yours. I have to speak to you."Posted 1 year ago # -
Dean
Member
Posted by unregistered user: DeanHarsh but true Ed. We just haven’t performed well defensively this campaign. It’s not only the Vidic injury but the sale of O’Shea and Brown, include to that Van Der Sar’s retirement and lack of a defensive midfielder and we have a receipy for disaster. At the start of the season it was all out attack, which gave everyone a hard on. The problem with that in Europe is it doesn’t work with sides that have more creativity. We got well and truly b***h slapped on Thursday but I find it hard to believe it would have happened if both Van Der Sar, Vidic and O’Shea were on the pitch. That being said, this crop of players will be fantastic in 3 years time and the top teams now will be going through a transition like we are now.
Posted 1 year ago # -
sheesh
Member
Alfonso Bedoya said:
It's hard to understand Ferguson these days... who knows what the fuck he's thinking anymore?When he said Barcelona taught us a lesson, and he would see that United would rise to the challenge... I was sure he knew exactly what was wrong, and was sure he had a real and definite plan to fix the problem... so how did we get so lost, and end up so far away from where we were supposed to be?
Was Ferguson seeing a totally different problem than nearly everyone else, and therefore had a totally different solution in mind?... if so, can someone explain to me what his solution is, cause I don't see it.
Or... did he see things the same way as everyone else, but just could find the solution?... and if this is the case, then I'd like to know why not.
Yup.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Neil
Member Posted by unregistered user: NeilEd, this is really spot on. One thing that really sticks out for me has been the air of complacency that otherwise rarely appears, I think subconsciously taking on the likes of Basel and Benfica caused some of the players to slip into a malaise. Bilbao are not a big name but have been oustanding at times under Bielsa and battered Barca at home in the league only to be pegged back late on in a 2-2 draw, they have great continuity among their young players and are hungry to succeed. As a side that can give excellent performances they are very dangerous in cup competitions, they have reached the final of the Copa del rey in Spain.
I think the experience of Vidic and to a lesser extent Fletcher have been key components missing, crucial cogs in the defensive core of the team. But I do trust the younger players to emerge stronger for it, there is a good group of youngsters here who have strong potential. The bottom line is that in the matches against high quality opposition, United’s central midfield will be found severely lacking, this is the most influential difference that is obvious to everyone, you would imagine Ferguson cannot let himself speak out about it too much because at the end of the day it comes down to a lack of funds to improve that area of the team. Some of United’s recent signings may have been for ‘big’ money but in each case it was more of a case of each player having their mind made up about which club to go to, I don’t think we will see any world class players coming to the club if they have other alternatives. We would wonder now, does Fergie expect the likes of Cleverley, Anderson and Pogba (if he stays) to eventually become good enough to form a half decent midfield?
The only way to reach Barca’s level is to generate a strong level of continuity and tactical awareness amongst the whole crop of young players. At such a point, the levels of technical ability will dictate how good the team will be. As we have seen elsewhere, having a shopping list of star names won’t necessarily make a brilliant team straight away.
Posted 1 year ago # -
redevil_83
Member Posted by unregistered user: redevil_83like every summer i will hope ferguson addreses the tactical and quality weakness in our mid fld when it comes to europe. but yet i will not be surprised if nothing is done about it. i know the gaffer is fixated on european glory, but i don’t see any lesson learned to bridge the gap since 2009 european cup final even. united can be happy about being kings in england, but not being able to compete even in a 2nd tier european competition speaks volumes.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Herbie Simms
Member Posted by unregistered user: Herbie SimmsYou hit the nail right on the head and I’ve been saying it all along. SAF has lost it for sometime now. He believes he has the best players in the world. He rates his players so high, including his flagging midfield. All this talk about Eden Hazard, we need more than just a Eden Hazard to compete in Europe. I will be happy to see SAF retire, even if we do win the league title for a 20th time. He can retire on a high.
Posted 1 year ago # -
ja
Member Posted by unregistered user: jaIn the days when the club used the money it generated for the club, Ferguson almost always brought in at least one top player a season to in his own words “shake things up” and avoid complacency. He also talked about players having to be determined to ‘stay on the bus’.
Now all he is able to bring in is promising youth, De Gea, Jones, cheap punts, Bebe Obertan Diouf, and middle rank mid 20s Young. None of them, goalkeepers excepted, is going to get the established squad on their mettle and saying “well that new so and so is not going to take my place!”
Which ultimately is the main reason for the decline, the hundreds of millions being syphoned off to pay banks etc because the plc board was too complacent to have a poison pill in place to ward off carpetbagging predators.
And Ferguson has got in bed with the Glazers, so he is going to have to lie in it (in both senses of the word!).Posted 1 year ago # -
Trydent – who’s bashing SAF? Perhaps you’re just reading what you want in this piece. You certainly can’t have read many articles on this site. But how typical of somebody who jumps to conclusions to lace a comment with personal insults. Says more about you.
Editor & Moderator at http://www.unitedrant.co.ukPosted 1 year ago # -
Trydent
Member Posted by unregistered user: TrydentHere we go with all the glory hunters bashing SAF! You arse holes need a reality check.The real reason our midfield cannot compete is the total lack of quality investment in our club.Giggs is 40 and cannot press. Scholes Is 37 and said last saeson his legs were gone.We have Park on the wrong side of 30.Ferdinand is the same. Vidic has been injured all season and DF also.TC has had little time on the pitch due to injury.Half the bloody squad has spent time on the treatment table.Yet you idiots come on and bash the manager! Why don’t you have a voice about the real cause.Those fucking vermin leeches that bought our club.Since the take over they have bleed us dry.Th money from CR would have never even had us having this discussion if it had been reinvested.Instead it went to that usa scum to fill their fat guts.As for this article it reeks of grand pointless, meaningless statements.125 years of proud history… What bloody crap is this? Humiliated by Barca… How is 3-1 a humiliation?Now out of the wood work come the knockers..The bloody sheep that bleet.Bah! Bah! Bah! Ed included!
Posted 1 year ago # -
Darel Luiz
Member Posted by unregistered user: Darel LuizAll along while watching the matches against Bilbao I kept thinking in my head, what if SAF just comes out for the post match interview and says ” I don’t know how to beat Sapnish Teams”.
There has been no closing of Gap and the Spanish teams are far superior in their style of play.
Posted 1 year ago # -
19 and Counting
Member
3 CL finals in 4 years and we're slating SAF. Wow. Yes, we have been poor in Europe this season but we are in first place in the league. SAF has done wonders with an injury-ravaged squad and it's largely because of him that we are top of the league right now. Let's see what happens to this club when he's not around anymore in 2 years' time. We have been spoiled.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Stevie D
Member Posted by unregistered user: Stevie DCan’t believe some of the SAF bashing! WTF! Surely it was down to the huge casualty list we suffered before Christmas that was to blame for our dip in form….both in the PL and the CL. We couldn’t get a decent, experienced team out every week. Obviously this was a major part of the problem, and we were out of the CL before we could turn things around.
As for going out of the Europa league….we have to draw a distinction between this and the CL. Did anyone really want us to be in the Europa league? I doubt it, I certainly am much more concerned about finishing ahead of City in the PL than winning the Europa league. So hardly a surprise this was reflected in the performances against Ajax and Bilbao.
However, even with a fully fit squad at its peak, I still don’t think we have closed the gap on Barca. They signed Fabregas to improve their already incredible squad; we signed Ashley Young! That says it all really. I doubt Fergie really sees Ashley Young as the missing ingredient to beating Barca. He’ll do against most of the PL teams, but he’s average at best.
The squad needs huge investment if we want to catch Barca, but the funds are not available. That is the problem in a nutshell!! Can we blame SAF for this? Of course not, unless you subscribe to Keano’s silly theory that is!! Fergies hands are tied, but he’s done an unbelievable job with this squad this season.Posted 1 year ago # -
Alfonso Bedoya
Moderator Commenter said:
Here we go with all the glory hunters bashing SAF! You arse holes need a reality check.The real reason our midfield cannot compete is the total lack of quality investment in our club.Giggs is 40 and cannot press. Scholes Is 37 and said last saeson his legs were gone.We have Park on the wrong side of 30.Ferdinand is the same. Vidic has been injured all season and DF also.TC has had little time on the pitch due to injury.Half the bloody squad has spent time on the treatment table.Yet you idiots come on and bash the manager! Why don’t you have a voice about the real cause.Those fucking vermin leeches that bought our club.Since the take over they have bleed us dry.Th money from CR would have never even had us having this discussion if it had been reinvested.Instead it went to that usa scum to fill their fat guts.As for this article it reeks of grand pointless, meaningless statements.125 years of proud history… What bloody crap is this? Humiliated by Barca… How is 3-1 a humiliation?Now out of the wood work come the knockers..The bloody sheep that bleet.Bah! Bah! Bah! Ed included!Like most Ranters here... I loathe the Glazers... passionately.
But you'd have to be stupid to not see that Ferguson, is at the very least satisfied with their ownership... and at worst complicit with their financial handling of the club.
Strong words from Ferguson, at any time, could start mass protests outside Old Trafford... but instead of condemning the Glazers... he tries very hard to convince us all that they are in fact...swell folks, and great owners.
Who would you like us to blame for that?
Posted 1 year ago # -
Bill
Member Posted by unregistered user: BillAlf has it right, we just don’t know what SAF is thinking these days. He is definitely coming to the end of his life as a manager, trying to keep up the standards set in the past with one hand tied behind his back due to the Glazers is wearing him down. It really is selection roulette at times.
Posted 1 year ago # -
DeadRevel
Member Posted by unregistered user: DeadRevelSo you admit that Ferguson rebelling against the Glazers would be a bad thing, then continue to criticise him in spite of that. Where’s the logic? Ferguson makes mistakes but I can’t really stomach Unied fans actually using him as a scapegoat.
What we need is players with quality on the ball. De Gea, Rafael, Smalling, Jones, Evans, Fabio, Nani, Clev, Pogba, Carrick, Scholes, Young, Rooney, Welbeck and Berba are all good enough to do this, but some of them need time to mature.
The fact remains, that if we hadn’t had a ridiculous injury list this season we’d be clear at the top of the league and probably still in Europe. And all we need is one energetic, passing and skillful central midfielder to completely rejuvenate us.
We will have money to spend this summer, especially if we let Berba go and (PLEASE) take Owen to fucking pasture. One midfielder and I’m confident that he, along with Clev, Carrick and Pogba, with Scholes / Giggs as midfield back ups will be good enough.
Relying on Scholes and Giggs is not good, but having them as back ups is fantastic. No-one better than experienced legends who know how to win.
Posted 1 year ago # -
DamnedUnited
Member Posted by unregistered user: DamnedUnitedSometimes, I feel that Fergie deliberately buys and plays young players or squad players to get them to fight harder. How he keeps them motivated to do this amazes me. Yes, Europe has been bad this season, but the fight the squad has shown in the league is extraordinary.
Look at Chelsea and Arsenal’s players. Chelsea’s old guard only perform when they can be bothered and will continue to be inconsistent once the novelty of ‘freedommmmmmmmm’ from AVB passes. Arsenal’s young players are mostly never complimented by experience so unless Arsene changes something, they won’t fight every last ball forever.
Man City however, lets see how long the collection of prima donnas continue to have that desire.
I do however, have a lot of respect for Mancini. Probably the only guy at that club.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Alfonso Bedoya
Moderator Commenter said:
So you admit that Ferguson rebelling against the Glazers would be a bad thing, then continue to criticise him in spite of that. Where’s the logic? Ferguson makes mistakes but I can’t really stomach Unied fans actually using him as a scapegoat.What we need is players with quality on the ball. De Gea, Rafael, Smalling, Jones, Evans, Fabio, Nani, Clev, Pogba, Carrick, Scholes, Young, Rooney, Welbeck and Berba are all good enough to do this, but some of them need time to mature.
The fact remains, that if we hadn’t had a ridiculous injury list this season we’d be clear at the top of the league and probably still in Europe. And all we need is one energetic, passing and skillful central midfielder to completely rejuvenate us.
We will have money to spend this summer, especially if we let Berba go and (PLEASE) take Owen to fucking pasture. One midfielder and I’m confident that he, along with Clev, Carrick and Pogba, with Scholes / Giggs as midfield back ups will be good enough.
Relying on Scholes and Giggs is not good, but having them as back ups is fantastic. No-one better than experienced legends who know how to win.
I'm not sure who you're talking to... but if it's me, then you can't read... I would have loved Ferguson to stand up and speak out against the Glazers... if he had, they may still have bought the club, but I don't think they could have held on to it.
And this... "The fact remains, that if we hadn’t had a ridiculous injury list this season we’d be clear at the top of the league"... is just as pointless as considering, that if the Bitters hadn't lost lost Toure for the ACN, and seen Kompany crocked for a few key games, then they'd have left us far behind.
In this world, at this time... the reality is... we've got the makings of a fantastic team... with a very bright young core... but it will all amount to fuck all, if we ignore the midfield... and that's exactly what has happened for far too long.
Ferguson has neglected the midfield ever since Keane started showing his wear and tear.
While all the top teams in the world, spent large snapping all the best midfield talent, Ferguson has handed the fans all manner of ridiculous excuses... all of which have only appeased the thick and ignorant... everyone can see that our midfield has been declining for years... the problem is, top midfielders are the most coveted players in the game... players with the best ball skills, and the creativity and vision to use them... teams like Real and Barca know this, which is why they snap them up at any cost, even if they don't need them at the moment... take a look at either teams subs bench and you will see players that would walk straight into our first eleven.
They cost money... a lot of it... but our owners won't spend it... and Ferguson lets them get away with that, by telling the fans that all is well... when it clearly isn't... and it's fans like you that, year after year, seem to think that, "this year will be different"... "this year, we'll get our man"... WE WON'T!... and when Ed writes an article suggesting that we won't, and why we won't... or when fans such as myself agree that we won't... then odious little shits like "Trydent" pop in out of nowhere, to call us "glory hunters" and other such nonsense.
The Glazers are ruining United... and Ferguson has done everything he can to support them for it... as legendary as he is to this club... I find that hard to stomach.
Posted 1 year ago # -
tony
Member Posted by unregistered user: tonyPatrice Evra jogged through the match; He’s jogged through the fucking season.I cant remember if Evra is actually a good defender?(NOT A FUCKING WINGER).When people say he has had a good game,It’s only in attack,I can’t remember a great tackle or anything defensively from him in such a long time.If i’m wrong let me know.
Posted 1 year ago # -
DeadRevel
Member Posted by unregistered user: DeadRevelNo, you’re wrong. You actually explained to yourself why you’re wrong and yet you continue to post the same shit. If you actually think this club would be better off without Ferguson you are a stupid cunt. Simple. No-one said he was perfect but it’s hardly his fucking fault if he isn’t allowed to spend money is it.
Oh and it’s not valid to compare City and United, obviously. Since we have had far more injuries. So again, I’ll repeat the simple fact: if we had the same amount of injuries as City this season, we would be comfortably ahead by now. You cant plan on an injury crisis.
What confuses me is that you actually seem to agree with me on the main issue which is that we need a new midfielder. What you are ignoring is that fact that our midfield was functioning very well st the start of the season, at which point many people were saying ‘I’m glad we didn’t buy Sneijder / Nasri’. This seems to be confirmed given that they’ve both been very mediocre this season. My point was that if Clev had remained fit then this ‘midfield crisis’ wouldn’t be a crisis. Even Ando was playing well and we had Morrison and Pogba to look forward to. Things change – that’s football. If Ferguson buys a top midfielder this summer and gets rid of Owen my faith will be restored.
But either way I will never accuse Ferguson of deliberately encouraging the decline of United like you.
Posted 1 year ago # -
DeadRevel
Member Posted by unregistered user: DeadRevelYes you’re right. He’s been shit for a long time. Hurts to say it, but it’s true. And those interviews he gave after the Euro elimination(s) were pretty hard to take considering he is as much to blame as anyone.
Though I can’t be too angry towards him – he is a United legend in my eyes and I think he lost his brother in late 2011. That combined with fatigue, the French debacle, the racism row etc must be difficult to cope with mentally.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Alfonso Bedoya
Moderator Commenter said:
No, you’re wrong. You actually explained to yourself why you’re wrong and yet you continue to post the same shit. If you actually think this club would be better off without Ferguson you are a stupid cunt. Simple. No-one said he was perfect but it’s hardly his fucking fault if he isn’t allowed to spend money is it.Oh and it’s not valid to compare City and United, obviously. Since we have had far more injuries. So again, I’ll repeat the simple fact: if we had the same amount of injuries as City this season, we would be comfortably ahead by now. You cant plan on an injury crisis.
What confuses me is that you actually seem to agree with me on the main issue which is that we need a new midfielder. What you are ignoring is that fact that our midfield was functioning very well st the start of the season, at which point many people were saying ‘I’m glad we didn’t buy Sneijder / Nasri’. This seems to be confirmed given that they’ve both been very mediocre this season. My point was that if Clev had remained fit then this ‘midfield crisis’ wouldn’t be a crisis. Even Ando was playing well and we had Morrison and Pogba to look forward to. Things change – that’s football. If Ferguson buys a top midfielder this summer and gets rid of Owen my faith will be restored.
But either way I will never accuse Ferguson of deliberately encouraging the decline of United like you.
You really should, read carefully, stop, and think before you type, especially if you're going to call anyone a "stupid cunt"
Because you could end up looking like a "stupid cunt"!
I'm one of Fergusons biggest fans... always have been... and it will be a bad day for United when he retires... and I'm not sure there is anyone out there that can follow him.
However... only he knows why he defends the Glazers... against the grain of most United supporters. No one said it was his fault that the Glazers are cunts... but the Glazers ARE cunts, and I'm sick of Ferguson telling me otherwise.
And you're right... it's not "valid to compare City and United"... regarding injuries... that's not what I was doing... I was trying, (and obviously failing) to point out to you, that "what ifs", mean fuck all. If Vidic is fit, then Evans doesn't play... who has been very good... how do you know that Vidic doesn't have a couple of rubbish games, and we'd have been better off with Evans... truth is, you don't... in fact, you proven with your ridiculous arguments, that you really don't know fuck all about anything.
As far as our midfield functioning well early season... well Wolves were top of the league after three games... what does that tell you... fuck all!... are you still there?
And as for this... "But either way I will never accuse Ferguson of deliberately encouraging the decline of United like you."?????????????????????????
You're an idiot!
Posted 1 year ago #
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