Vs Villa (Cup)

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JoelfuckingGlazer
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Sid wrote: 2 years ago It's hard to determine whether or not we've made progress defensivly cos yeah we're not letting in as many goals but we're also there for the taking in many games. If feels like we're one hiding away from the progress myth being busted.

We play Villa again on Saturday, and as someone said earlier in this thread, they'll probably do us. When they turned it on we couldn't live with them. We became nervous and frustrated.

Once teams get over the fear factor of the names on the teamsheet, they know we're shit. Villa are 13th ffs and we couldn't live with em.
Steven Gerrard has been at Villa for 2 weeks longer than Ralf has been here. And he's been getting that level of performance from Villa, largely from the off. Now you can't tell me that he's better equipped to coach a team than Ralf. And you can't tell me that Villa have better players than we do.

Surely there's a base level of capability we should be seeing? We're a mile off. Something looks rotten with that group.
sheesh
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Nothing's going to change until we sell a few players and bring a few in.

We have half the squad wanting to leave and players who simply aren't good enough.

Things might well get worse before they get better.

I also go back to a question nobody really knows the answer to: just how much power does this manager actually have? What can he do and what can he not do?

I thought the whole point of bringing Rangnick in was to lay the groundwork for the next manager. We may do some business in January, but if we don't, what was the point of bringing him in?
Fuck the Glazers
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Might be time to re-evaluate the Ole era. He got better performances out of the squad than Rangnick has managed so far. They would often put in a shocker, but then nearly always turn it around. That's not happening now.
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JoelfuckingGlazer
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Sid wrote: 2 years ago Might be time to re-evaluate the Ole era. He got better performances out of the squad than Rangnick has managed so far. They would often put in a shocker, but then nearly always turn it around. That's not happening now.
I was thinking that earlier. These players have abdicated any sense of responsibility for performing at the top level, under numerous managers. And we get the same schoolground chatter being leaked too.

It makes me wonder what Ragnicks remit actually is. Is it to lay the groundwork for a proper cultural and footballing reset ahead of a permanent change in the summer? Is he being backed to do what's necessary on that basis? Or his remit based on prioritising results to secure top 4 football. I'm very much hoping its the former, but he needs to be backed to do it properly. We could be looking at having to change 50% of this squad within 12 months.
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bman2
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Nah, the Ole era was going nowhere. Never got above mid-70s in the league despite massive expenditure on players. Defensive record was shit. Set pieces were the worst in the league. Ole didn't shit the bed like Lampard did at Chelsea, and he deserves credit for that, but the club was clearly just wasting time and money with him in charge. It was obvious from the very beginning of the season that the players were fed up with Ole. What we're seeing now started long before Ralf took over: it's the reason he took over.

The club have totally fucked up this season. Yet again they have brought in a totally totally different style of manager to the one he replaces, and they're doing it in the middle of the season. And the management of the squad has been totally hopeless. I'm not going to put that on Ole or Rangnick, I think ultimately it's the people above them who keep making the worst decisions.

The rest of the season will be a bit shit. But I think that probably the best outcome now is if Ralf gets to have some say in who the permanent manager and that he then has some real power in a DoF role. If we have a manager and a proper DoF working on the same page, finally, that's the only hope we have as supporters I think. The season is a write-off. Let's let the work Ralf is doing now at least matter for next season,.
Fuck the Glazers
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bman2 wrote: 2 years ago Nah, the Ole era was going nowhere. Never got above mid-70s in the league despite massive expenditure on players. Defensive record was shit. Set pieces were the worst in the league. Ole didn't shit the bed like Lampard did at Chelsea, and he deserves credit for that, but the club was clearly just wasting time and money with him in charge. It was obvious from the very beginning of the season that the players were fed up with Ole. What we're seeing now started long before Ralf took over: it's the reason he took over.

The club have totally fucked up this season. Yet again they have brought in a totally totally different style of manager to the one he replaces, and they're doing it in the middle of the season. And the management of the squad has been totally hopeless. I'm not going to put that on Ole or Rangnick, I think ultimately it's the people above them who keep making the worst decisions.

The rest of the season will be a bit shit. But I think that probably the best outcome now is if Ralf gets to have some say in who the permanent manager and that he then has some real power in a DoF role. If we have a manager and a proper DoF working on the same page, finally, that's the only hope we have as supporters I think. The season is a write-off. Let's let the work Ralf is doing now at least matter for next season,.
That's the thing though, we already have a DoF in John Murtough. Rangnick is going to be a consultant. But so is Ed. Meanwhile the most powerful job at United, the CEO, is going to Richard Arnold. So who is going to be steering the ship? All of these people have a vision for the club, and all of their roles hold a lot of power.

Rangnick is looking like another ill thought out move by the club. If you're cynical, nothing more than a PR move after the ESL fall out and effective fan action.
fat maradona
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Sid wrote: 2 years ago
Rangnick is looking like another ill thought out move by the club. If you're cynical, nothing more than a PR move after the ESL fall out and effective fan action.
We need to be patient re Rangnick. He has track record of implementing solid structures at clubs and doesn't seem like the kind of guy that will roll over and get his belly tickled. Let's give the club the benefit of doubt re what they want to achieve over the next 3 years. Agreed, there are too many cooks in the kitchen but hopefully they're all aligned.

Perhaps Ralf is a little bit caught in the headlights, he clearly didn't expect the issues to be as big as they are. And not having managed for a few years will also have an impact on how he is managing the team on a day to day basis. It's a super valid point re his backroom staff, they're all nobodies and they're not his first choice but this is typical of United......sack the manager without having any contingency plans whatsoever....
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Jason
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Sid wrote: 2 years ago
bman2 wrote: 2 years ago Nah, the Ole era was going nowhere. Never got above mid-70s in the league despite massive expenditure on players. Defensive record was shit. Set pieces were the worst in the league. Ole didn't shit the bed like Lampard did at Chelsea, and he deserves credit for that, but the club was clearly just wasting time and money with him in charge. It was obvious from the very beginning of the season that the players were fed up with Ole. What we're seeing now started long before Ralf took over: it's the reason he took over.

The club have totally fucked up this season. Yet again they have brought in a totally totally different style of manager to the one he replaces, and they're doing it in the middle of the season. And the management of the squad has been totally hopeless. I'm not going to put that on Ole or Rangnick, I think ultimately it's the people above them who keep making the worst decisions.

The rest of the season will be a bit shit. But I think that probably the best outcome now is if Ralf gets to have some say in who the permanent manager and that he then has some real power in a DoF role. If we have a manager and a proper DoF working on the same page, finally, that's the only hope we have as supporters I think. The season is a write-off. Let's let the work Ralf is doing now at least matter for next season,.
That's the thing though, we already have a DoF in John Murtough. Rangnick is going to be a consultant. But so is Ed. Meanwhile the most powerful job at United, the CEO, is going to Richard Arnold. So who is going to be steering the ship? All of these people have a vision for the club, and all of their roles hold a lot of power.

Rangnick is looking like another ill thought out move by the club. If you're cynical, nothing more than a PR move after the ESL fall out and effective fan action.

Just to note, I'm pretty sure the club came out the other week and said that once Ed is gone, he's gone. No consultancy role for him. Thankfully
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JoelfuckingGlazer
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fat maradona wrote: 2 years ago
Sid wrote: 2 years ago
Rangnick is looking like another ill thought out move by the club. If you're cynical, nothing more than a PR move after the ESL fall out and effective fan action.
We need to be patient re Rangnick. He has track record of implementing solid structures at clubs and doesn't seem like the kind of guy that will roll over and get his belly tickled. Let's give the club the benefit of doubt re what they want to achieve over the next 3 years. Agreed, there are too many cooks in the kitchen but hopefully they're all aligned.

Perhaps Ralf is a little bit caught in the headlights, he clearly didn't expect the issues to be as big as they are. And not having managed for a few years will also have an impact on how he is managing the team on a day to day basis. It's a super valid point re his backroom staff, they're all nobodies and they're not his first choice but this is typical of United......sack the manager without having any contingency plans whatsoever....
Ralf doesn't strike me as being caught in the headlights, though I imagine he may be taken aback by the culture at United and lack of ability in some players.

Its back to my earlier point re. his remit. I just hope he's been properly charged (and backed) to oversee a proper rebuild of the football structure at the club, and not just 'steer the ship for 6 months'.
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swampash
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Sid wrote: 2 years ago
Rangnick is looking like another ill thought out move by the club. If you're cynical, nothing more than a PR move after the ESL fall out and effective fan action.
Oh come on Sid - it's a bit early to be writing Ralph off as a PR stunt!
As I've said before, if he can't fix it, then no one can.
Keep the faith - from my point of view I think there are clear signs that a good number of the players get what he's trying to do and are trying to implement it. Look at how Shaw, Telles and Dalot are coming through - all looking good and fullbacks are a key part of the formula [plus I still see Telles as a midfield option]. Fitness is a key issue of course, which will take time to build up, and we need to be able to play a higher line with out back 4, which pretty much spells curtains for Maguire.
Some clearly don't get it [or don't want to get it] and they should be moved on asap, but from my perspective we're only a couple of astute signings away from the right line up for gegenpressing, if you ask me...
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